This just doesn't seem right

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 4:47 pm

I have a 2015 1200RT and I'm concerned about the way the transmission is acting.  First off let me say being a former Harley owner I'm used to hearing/feeling a "clank" when being shifted, but this just doesn't seem the same. 
When the engine/transmission is cool or cold (first start of the day) I can shift it into first and it literally just clicks and goes right in.  After the bike is ridden and warms up, at a stop in neutral, I then put it into 1st gear and CLANK it goes in and the bike actually lurches forward, I mean REALLY lurches.  And then when I shift from 1st to 2nd, (and I have tried every different combination as to technique) I can feel the gears not meshing at all and another CLANK.  It's almost like it's doing damage to it.  Second to 3rd gear is slightly less dramatic but still seems to "grind" a little.  The higher gears seems much better to no issues.  I do notice when I shift at a lower RPM around 2500-3000 (which seems and feels really odd to do) it's not as noisy or clanky.  Can this be normal? Other bikes that are near me at stop lights when I shift into 1st look at the bike like they are thinking WTH was that? Does this bike have some different type of transmission than any other motorcycle?  This is actually stoping me from riding the thing much. It just doesn't seem correct.  Do any of you have any thoughts you can share?

Thanks in advance
Ron

Post by **Beagle** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:06 pm

Mine does as well. If you search this forum and google it you will find others with the same experience.

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:14 pm

Thanks.  A few weeks ago, I called the dealer where I bought it, and the tech suggested leaning the bike over to the right as far as I could and working the clutch lever 20 or more times letting it "pop" out briskly.  He said perhaps it's air in the hydraulic system.  I did tell him before he suggested that that if was a cable type clutch it seems like the clutch is not disengaging all the way. I did what he suggested and there was no improvement.

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:20 pm

What you describe seems similar to mine except for the lurch forward. When cold my bike snicks into first. When warm it clanks into first. However I don't get the bike wanting to lurch forward. That to me seems as if the clutch is not disengaging fully. How does the clutch feel ? If you decide to bleed the clutch remember it takes mineral fluid, do not use normal hydraulic fluid this will destroy the seals. If you have a BMW dealer nearby I would go and get them to check your bike. If they have a test bike handy take it for a short ride and see how it compares.

Post by **mcwhirtj** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:24 pm

A clunky/clanky shift is normal for the RT (just search forums like other poster said).  However, the lurching forward is not, imo, normal.  That sounds like a clutch issue, possibly. 

Others may have better opinion or suggestions, but if you sit on  the bike, engine off and in 1st gear, and pull in the clutch, does it feel like it is dragging when you push the bike forward?  That is one of several things you could do to check out clutch. The pre-water cooled RT's had a wet clutch so on those there is always some drag, but unless I am mistaken the 15 has a dry clutch so that should not be a factor.

But the noise just is a part of the whole RT package, for sure.  Not so sure about the "lurching" going into gear.

Jim

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Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:32 pm

[size=4px]Levisp

The clutch feels ok from what I can tell, but the lurching has got me baffled. Thanks for the mineral fluid info

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:32 pm

Just check my clutch lever and it feels very positive. Not at all spongy. A trick that can be used on brakes to get air out of the system is to cable tie the brake ON overnight. Not sure if this works for clutches but I guess there is no harm in trying.

If you put the bike on centre stand and start the engine. Select first gear with clutch fully depressed the back wheel will spin slightly but should be very easy to stop. If its hard to stop then that would indicate to me the clutch is dragging hence the lurch forward.

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:36 pm

mcwhirtj wrote: A clunky/clanky shift is normal for the RT (just search forums like other poster said).  However, the lurching forward is not, imo, normal.  That sounds like a clutch issue, possibly. 

Others may have better opinion or suggestions, but if you sit on  the bike, engine off and in 1st gear, and pull in the clutch, does it feel like it is dragging when you push the bike forward?  That is one of several things you could do to check out clutch. The pre-water cooled RT's had a wet clutch so on those there is always some drag, but unless I am mistaken the 15 has a dry clutch so that should not be a factor.

But the noise just is a part of the whole RT package, for sure.  Not so sure about the "lurching" going into gear.

Jim

Jim, Yes for sure the bike is not as easy to push across the garage floor in 1st with the clutch in as it does when it's in neutral. But is there an adjustment of some kind for this? I was thinking there isn't.

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:38 pm

mcwhirtj wrote: A clunky/clanky shift is normal for the RT (just search forums like other poster said).  However, the lurching forward is not, imo, normal.  That sounds like a clutch issue, possibly. 

Others may have better opinion or suggestions, but if you sit on  the bike, engine off and in 1st gear, and pull in the clutch, does it feel like it is dragging when you push the bike forward?  That is one of several things you could do to check out clutch. The pre-water cooled RT's had a wet clutch so on those there is always some drag, but unless I am mistaken the 15 has a dry clutch so that should not be a factor.

But the noise just is a part of the whole RT package, for sure.  Not so sure about the "lurching" going into gear.

Jim

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Wet / dry clutch the wrong way round. Pre water cooled bikes had a dry clutch like a car they did not suffer from first gear clunk. The water cooled bikes have the clutch at the front of the engine and is a traditional motorcycle wet clutch.

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:44 pm

One other thing you could try is to increase the span adjuster on lever to maximum. This will increase the lever leverage. May help. Again if it does then I'm thinking you have air in the system because naturally the clutch should work regardless of what the span adjuster is on.

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:50 pm

OK so I went out and put it on the center stand. Started it and shifted it into 1st and CLANK the rear wheel did start to turn but stopped. As the bike warmed up it seemed to get worse. 
So is there an adjustment that can be made by the dealer or is it going to be "it is what it is".  I have done the 'lean the bike over and pop the clutch in and out' several times.  Next step?

Oh and by the way this has done this since new, but It had been in storage while I was in the Bahamas with my boat for 6 months over last winter, AND it's JUST out of warranty.

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 5:54 pm

Can one of you put your bike up on the center stand and see if yours does the same thing (rear wheel spins when you shift into 1st)

The other thing that happens, is when the clutch is fully in, if I  s l o w l y put it into 1st gear it grinds like bitch

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:01 pm

Rwslater wrote: Can one of you put your bike up on the center stand and see if yours does the same thing (rear wheel spins when you shift into 1st)

The other thing that happens, is when the clutch is fully in, if I  s l o w l y put it into 1st gear it grinds like bitch

Yes. Mine will spin the rear wheel a little because of the clutch drag in the engine oil but not enough that would make the bike lurch forward. I always give the gear lever a good positive prod when selecting first to avoid the gears grinding.

Post by **Rwslater** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:03 pm

Yes. Mine will spin the rear wheel a little because of the clutch drag in the engine oil but not enough that would make the bike lurch forward. I always give the gear lever a good positive prod when selecting first to avoid the gears grinding.

Thanks

Post by **Levisp** » Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:29 pm

One last thought. Warning I cannot remember if I did this to my current bike or whether it was another bike but here goes. If you take the clutch lever off you should find an adjustable rod that actuates the clutch master cylinder. If you undo lock nut and rotate rod to make it longer then it will increase the travel of the piston in the master cylinder which will increase the slave cylinder travel and may increase clutch disengagement. Only turn the rod one turn at a time and then test. I did this trick on one of my bikes but I cannot remember which one so take this bit of advice with a health warning. Be careful with this.

BMW R1200RT/R1250RT Forum